Dreams of Saint Leonard

[Nazaree]

Hello,

I'm new here; this is my first post on this forum. I "discovered" Leonard Cohen at the age of 17, when a French newspaper in Montreal published a French translation of one of Cohen's Recent Songs in its Arts pages. I was enchanted and purchased Death of a Lady's Man (the book), which I used to teach myself English. I now teach English literature and, every year, I introduce at least one of Cohen's books to at least one of my classes.

I have a strange question to ask all of you: do you have dreams about Leonard Cohen? Does he visit you in your dreams? Every five years or so, I have powerful dreams--spiritual ones (come on!! )--about Cohen or about something related to him.

To give you an example: in one of these dreams there was a war and I realized that the city's water supplies had been cut off. Water was to be found only in Cohen's house in Montreal, which I reached with difficulty as I had to cross entire areas turned to rubble. Once inside I saw that parts of his house had also been destroyed by the war, but one room remained intact--the dining-room. There was a hole in the ceiling and light filtered in and shone upon the dining-room table. I pulled a chair to sit down and realized that the same emblem was carved on every chair: a bee. When I woke up I researched the symbology of the bee and learned that it stands for the spirit.

I realize that I must sound like a crazed little mystic here, but I have no such dreams about anybody else. I see that some people would like to see Cohen receive a Nobel Prize. Could we canonize him too (outside of literary circles, that is...)?

[Tchocolatl]

You Troll! Drop your weapon and bring me to your leader! Comply!

If this is real, this is strange for an awake mind, but normal for the language of the uncounscious - therefor not impossible as a true story. Water is the symbol for emotion. I guess that you often find comfort into the work of Leonard Cohen over the years (not that it is strange, as most of the fans say this, but the symbols are saying this also) (Oh! and welcome aboard Troll or not Troll could you bee)

[Nazaree]

You Troll! Drop your weapon and bring me to your leader! Comply!

Tchocolat: What does the above line mean?

As for finding comfort in Cohen's work... Perhaps "comfort" is the wrong word. It's not a comforting oeuvre, is it? It's apocalyptic, dark. Funny too, of course. Lyrical. Profoundly universal in its appeal. But I'd never describe it as comforting. I teach Cohen every year and my students like him because he's "cool." When I ask them what they mean by that, exactly, they say "he's sarcastic but in a hilarious way." I guess this is what Irving Layton meant when de described Cohen's works as "depressive-manic" (rather than the other way around).

Anyway...

[Tchocolatl]

1) It is a joke. I was referring to the other thread "what happen to this board" and the experience Joe had. The timing was just too inviting.
and
2) It was a question as well.

Now that you have answered, I know that you were serious, the uncounscious is such a trickster, and it seems that the board is kind of infested, these days according to the same thread. I was not sure.

Leonard Cohen is certainly what you have said.

Now regarding my previous post, I explain then :

Well, Nazaree, as a English teacher, you may find a better word for "réconfort". I don't. I checked just in case in my Robert&Collins Senior :neither.

If you continue to read this board, you will find that many fans, for as many reasons as they are life experiences - found and still find comfort (I am one of them) in Leonard Cohen works.

As for your dream I think that your uncouscious reveals that you did also, without maybe having noticed at the conscious level.

As for your question - I had dream, just one time about Leonard Cohen, it was during a period where I was worrying a lot. He looked just like on the back of DH booklet, the photo of him under his father portrait. He was telling me that everything will be OK with his deep beautiful voice.

Michel Garneau said the way he was signing helped him to go over the depression.

He himself (LC) said in the past, that music is a healer.

Voilà!

[Nazaree]

Thank you for your answer, Tchocolatl. (I still don't know what a troll is--I guess I'll have to go back to old posts and see how it's used).

I see what you mean by "comfort"--or "solace": comfort in distress or disappointment. Okay--I get it. Your dream about Cohen saying that everything is going to be all right is exactly what I meant by my initial post. NOTHING is Cohen's work actually suggests that ANYTHING will turn out to be all right. As I wrote earlier, he's fairly apocalyptic, plutôt grinçant. And yet in these dreams (yours, mine), he's a source of spirituality, gentleness, and--yes--comfort, solace, consolation. Which is why I jokingly suggested that he be canonized.

I forget what he writes about sainthood in Beautiful Losers. A saint is...? I remember it vaguely, so can't quote it exactly. At least I think it's from BL... Good grief--somebody ought to produce a dictionary of quotations just for Cohen's work...

On a slightly different note--I was just flipping through BL and refreshed my memory as to the whole matter of Isis--the lifting of the veil of Isis--the importance of women in one's search for spirituality... Looks like Cohen broke the Da Vinci code!!

[jurica]

Thank you for your answer, Tchocolatl. (I still don't know what a troll is--I guess I'll have to go back to old posts and see how it's used).

see my last post on "you" and "you".

I forget what he writes about sainthood in Beautiful Losers. A saint is...? I remember it vaguely, so can't quote it exactly. At least I think it's from BL... Good grief--somebody ought to produce a dictionary of quotations just for Cohen's work...

belive it or not, Marie Mazur, actualy already made it! interactive and searchable!

it's here: http://www.webheights.net/cohenconcordance/

and here's what i find in two simple clicks:

What is a saint? A saint is someone who has achieved a remote possibility. It is impossible to say what that possibility is. I think it has something to do with the energy of love. Contact with this energy results in the exercise of a kind of balance in the chaos of existence. A saint does not dissolve the chaos; if he did the world would have changed long ago.

[Tchocolatl]

Thank you for your answer, Tchocolatl. (I still don't know what a troll is--I guess I'll have to go back to old posts and see how it's used).

My pleasure Nazaree

I posted an answer regarding the troll in "What is happening to this board" thread.

I posted two links because just one point of view is never enough for me, I like to see all the sides of a question, but my marked preference goes to :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll

And I think the most important part of this article is (I emphasized the bold and underlined passages) :

"Resolutions and alternatives

In general, popular wisdom advises users to avoid feeding trolls, and to ignore temptations to respond. Responding to a troll inevitably drives discussion off-topic, to the dismay of bystanders, and supplies the troll with the craved attention. When trollhunters pounce on the trolls, ignorers reply with: "YHBT. YHL. HAND.", or "You have been trolled. You have lost. Have a nice day." However, since trollhunters (like trolls) are often conflict-seekers themselves, the loss usually is not on the part of the trollhunter; rather, the losers are the other forum-users who would have preferred that the conflict not emerge at all.

Literature on conflict resolution suggests that labeling participants in Internet discussions as trolls can perpetuate the unwanted behaviors. A person rejected by a social group, both online and "IRL", may assume an antagonistic role toward it, and seek to further annoy or anger members of the group. The "troll" label, often a sign of social rejection, may therefore perpetuate trolling.

Better results normally ensue when users take the moderator role and describe more constructive behaviors in a non-judgmental, non-confrontational way. Trolls are excited by trollhunters and frustrated by ignorers, and neither of these emotions produce positive results for the forum."

For me it is time to close the troll file now

As Jurica already told you, there is a lot of interesting subjects about Leonard Cohen in this forum that you can search and came back "to life" with new comments of your own.

(As well if you go in the Leonard Cohen webring you may find a lot of information you are seeking for. )

[linda_lakeside]

Tchoco, no don't close the troll file yet!! I just want to make one remark. I didn't know that the troll reference had a true 'definition'. I honestly thought it was something that was coined by somebody in the forum!! Honest. See - I don't get around to other forums and chatrooms. There! You can close the troll file now. I've said far, far too much.

Linda.

[linda_lakeside]

Hi Nazaree,

On your question re: dreams, I have also dreamt of Leonard, more than once. I can't remember the details (if this happens again, I'll jot them down ), when I thought about it, I realized that he is/was the only 'celebrity' that I had had a dream about. I'm pretty sure it wasn't one of those dreams, but I think your story was interesting. I assumed I was too much of a fan, which I don't really think is the case. I suppose I relate to his lyrics/music/poetry on a deeper level than I had previously thought. Well, time to log off and go to bed, to sleep...you teach EnglishLit, you know what's coming

Linda.

[Tchocolatl]

Linda, please read carefully.

"For me it is time to close the troll file now "

Conclusion : as you are not me, you can continue as long as you want.

[linda_lakeside]

OK, how about this? It's time for me to close troll file, also? I've spent far too much time on that nonsense. File closed for both you and me.

Linda.

[sebmelmoth2003]

another saint leonard!!

Music writers. Who needs ’em? We recently had the opportunity to get musician Saint Leonard and polymath Jonathan Meades together.

We left the pair to have a conversation about both their individual practice and attitude to craft, without any interference from us....

https://thequietus.com/interviews/in-co ... -interview

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kieran_Leonard