Dance me to the children who are asking to be born?

judah · Post by **judah** » Tue Jul 26, 2005 4:56 pm

"Some girls wander by mistake
into the mess that scalpels make
...
I need you to carry my children in
...
I need you to kill a child
...
Dance me to the children
who are asking to be born"

????????????

step · Post by **step** » Thu Jul 28, 2005 8:24 pm

"Destroy another fetus now we don't like children anyhow."

I wonder what point your trying to make.

Aslak · Post by **Aslak** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 2:46 am

Probably something about that Leonard's songs make it seem that he is against abortion.

Btw: does anyone know whether Leonard actually is against abortion or not? As a Swede I find it extremely difficult to imagine an intelligent person like Leonard being against abortion, but what do I know? After all, he is Jewish, raised in a Catholic region.

Teratogen · Post by **Teratogen** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 8:05 am

don't forget:

"Ah, there is no comfort in the covens of the witch,
some very clever doctor went and sterilized the bitch,
and the only man of energy, yes the revolution's pride,
he trained a hundred women just to kill an unborn child. "

hleonard · Post by **hleonard** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 7:31 pm

step · Post by **step** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 8:40 pm

Thanks, that about wraps it up.
Life is cruel, people are cruel, cruel desisions are made and we suffer
behind those choices.
Yes, we have refuge and can at least see things for what they may, or may
not be.
Have a nice day.

tomsakic · Post by **tomsakic** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:35 am

We must divide the man from the text (lyrics). I agree with hleonard's words. Also, doesn't it says in Anthem:

We asked for signs
the signs were sent:
the birth betrayed,
the marriage spent;
yeah, the widowhood
of every government –
signs for all to see.

Of course, someone could tell this means LC is against abortion (birth was betrayed) and divorce (the mariagge was spent). But I always got those lines - as whole song of course - on much deeper, transcendental level. I mean, of course people can't split their relationship, and abortion is right of choice, but in some wilder moment I'd think that in really happy rejoicing utopian culture and society all chidlren would be born and every love will be happy. That's widowhood of our society, and really, those are signs to see. That's all. Doesn't mean he personally is against abortion. He did say once that he detaches LC of the real world from the narrator of the songs, reffering to The Future and Democracy and similar songs. Speaking of Democracy, we have there also "wells of dissapointment"...

Syntax · Post by **Syntax** » Tue Jun 19, 2007 9:26 am

Yes, it's quite possible (I think probable) that Cohen is against abortion, but I believe that many of the lyric excerpts you've quoted are trying to say something else entirely. Cohen has always been fascinated by Tibetan Buddhism, in which the soul, after dying, wanders the Earth in search for a couple making love, and chooses to be born. This is where I believe "Children who are asking to be born" comes from.

Manna · Post by **Manna** » Tue Jun 19, 2007 7:10 pm

I don't think he has ever come out and pointedly said, "I am against abortion." I don't think he ever would. He doesn't seem to go for issues that way. Has he ever come out to endorse a candidate?

Mirek · Post by **Mirek** » Tue Jun 19, 2007 8:49 pm

Aslak wrote:Probably something about that Leonard's songs make it seem that he is against abortion.

Btw: does anyone know whether Leonard actually is against abortion or not? As a Swede I find it extremely difficult to imagine an intelligent person like Leonard being against abortion, but what do I know? After all, he is Jewish, raised in a Catholic region.

Now tell me please - what is the connection between being intelligent (or non-intelligent) and being pro- or against abortion. Does that mean that Jews and/or Catholics that don't approve abortion are not intelligent?
Is being a Swede a kind of a clue?

I really don't understand that.

Mirek

KjeXXXer · Post by **KjeXXXer** » Tue Jun 19, 2007 10:20 pm

Bold statement, indeed.

Syntax · Post by **Syntax** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 7:34 am

Not to mention that it's possible to be pro-choice, but still see abortion as being morally wrong.

KjeXXXer · Post by **KjeXXXer** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 4:35 pm

That's news to me.

Manna · Post by **Manna** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 5:12 pm

Axel,
If you believe it's not a decision one can make for another, then it's possible to be pro-choice for the sake of others, but to be personally against abortion for your own life.

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 5:18 pm

It's also possible to believe that we have the right to make our own good/bad/otherwise/moral/immoral/no-judgement choices... and still opt to make what we may consider to make an 'immoral'/illegal/whatever choice, for whatever set of reasons we prioritize in our decision- and choice-making... a right to make our own mistakes, and to suffer whatever the consequences. It all may seem wholly contradictory, but it's not. A 'lesser' example might be a young woman stringently raised that sex before marriage is immoral... yet, due to passion, disregard, rebellion, or whatever, makes the choice to have sex before marriage... feelings of guilt may ensue, or she may reconsider judgements of morality/immorality; yet, a contradictory-to-personal-belief-for-herself decision/choice was made at the time of her actions.

~ Lizzy

Dance me to the children who are asking to be born?

Dance me to the children who are asking to be born?

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